INTERVIEW: KAI WONG
28 May 2012
KAI WONG shares his latest feature film project, “BIBLE OF
ROMANCE”, thoughts on Masculinity and on life as an independent Actor-Producer after Hollywood.
We caught up with actor and producer KAI WONG between the Cannes Film Festival 2012 and the Locarno Film Festival 2012 in Switzerland to check up on the hottest
project in Asian cinema.
KAI WONG's project “BIBLE OF ROMANCE” was hand-picked out of thousands of entries. It is one of a select few Greater
China projects chosen by the independent film festival circuit, and presented at
the Hong Kong Asian Film Financing Forum (HAF) 2011 jointly with ACE. He is also currently working on "JOHN HEIR" and "PIPA GIRLS".
On starting his career by being chosen to join Merchant Ivory at its Manhattan headquarters:
"[Merchant] told me to write this long essay on the person
who most influenced my life. This was before hiring me right out of graduation.
Right after September 11. And just not long before New York began to forget the
terrible burning smell in the City. I wrote a piece about an imaginary painting
in a Louvre-like museum which I visited
when a city was burning. Kinda like an imaginary “Da Vinci” code, where I
discovered a secret painting that came to life.
The climax of the piece was..... instead of discovering [smiles]
the rapture of Mona Lisa's ambiguous smile, I found the secret shining eyes of a
mysterious figure, eyes that came to life in the painting. The essay ended with
the revelation that those eyes contained the mysterious name, which is the
secret code to Eternity and Love.
Even though Merchant-Ivory already had a “three-headed team” of
Ruth Prawala, Ismail Merchant and James Ivory, he felt he needed me in the
office right away.
So he added me to his triuvirate of Jewish/Moslem/Christian
production office. He liked my piece and all my work. He immediately trusted me with
the biggest tasks, then hired me on the spot, without even seeing my demo. I
went on to help him and his team produce Le Divorce, with Naomi Watts,
Kate Hudson and Glenn Close, The White Countess with Ralph Fiennes and
the late Natasha Richardson, and a string of his last movies... pre-production of City of Your Final Destination....we were thinking of putting Brad Pitt and Tina Turner before we decided on Charlotte Gainsbourg. Not long after,
he sadly passed away, closing a glorious chapter in Hollywood history.”
On “BIBLE OF ROMANCE: THE FINAL CHAPTER”, latest feature film project, selected in Hong Kong, and on the line-up at Cannes:
""I'm producing, writing and developing this feature film.
It's a movie that's impossible to put into words as it's
mostly visual cinema. I can only say this. It's eclectically influenced by... Romeo + Juliet, E.T.,
Breathless, Chris Marker, some aspects of 1970s American
classic soft porn and [coughs] Evangelical Christian screenings. All
rolled into one. The move is spellbinding and will break your heart and is unforgettable.
Those are all good films that make people remember their
first romance with cinema, and feel the first Spring air of love. Cinema is
fast vanishing as Entertainment. We had moved from the Nickelodeon to the silent pictures to the talkies to panoramic to digital and cinema as we know it is disappearing leisure technology. “Bible Of Romance” will be our glorious
conclusion. It'll be a summary of that collective cinema experience.
I can't say more that that. All the rest is confidential and
secret. 'Cos I've had countless indies and studios play with my treatments.
I've had many ideas ripped off already, and I can't afford any more
infringement of copyright issues or creative loss and bleeding.
Visually, “Bible of Romance” is lush, romantic, art
house glamorous, gorgeous costumes and sets, but faster paced, and appeals to
the U.S. markets especially the emerging markets, in China, Greater China, East
Asian and India....think “Slumdog Millionaire” impact.
And yes, it is about religion. Or should I say about religions. And about the truth. But of course
not the type of religion you read about using to justify bombings or terrorist
attacks daily in the newspapers. It's about real religion. Just like every real family includes a mother, a real religion includes love. All religions
are ways of expressing and finding love, which is at its very core, and its life. I'm spelling
love here with capital L, O, V, E. That's what “Bible of Romance” is, at its core.
I've had lots of interest from Latin America and territories
throughout Greater China. Thank you for letting me have the chance to do my
little advertizing here.
[Smiles charismatically.]
On working with legendary Hollywood producer Ismail Merchant:
“It's very dynamic team that Ismail refers to as his family. His partner, his lifelong friends, his family, his nephews, his nieces and his old and new friends in Hollywood. That's why he cooks for everyone like one big family.
Inside the production office though, business is business. A typical day runs like this......I'd arrive at the office at like,
say, 7:30 in the morning and not leave until, like, way in the night. The
office never really stops. Neither do the ringing phones, beeping e-mails and
constantly activated answering machines...the office has a life of its own even
without people in it.......people move in and out of it constantly....and we try to schedule as many execs in as possible....and there are always concurrent "emergencies".
For example, Kate Hudson needs to be called in to correct her valley accent for a re-dubbing, the editor needs to be called in to re-edit certain scenes, Glenn Close's Assistant called and she may want to see certain dailies or rough cuts to make sure it's as agreed. Expensive antiques need to be acquired for the set, we need to plan our domestic and international publicity campaigns and premieres, press premieres, we chart our campaigns on maps, the Academy Awards and invitations - whom to give them out to, add to that financial budgeting, gigabytes of constantly changing schedules on excel worksheets, cast and crew lists for several simultaneous productions. The telephone calls and visitors we vet in are another animal. Hollywood honchos and producers and distributors all over the world call
for help, for advice, for negotiation, for changes, for confirmations, to invite us to the White House or festivals, to plead for a 15 minute slot to invite Ismail or James for an interview. It's endless.
But we try to catch up on sleep when L.A. takes dinner break,
and then try to fall asleep at home before the next day back in the midtown
bustle and grind. We all do this for very very little. Yeah. It's a very notoriously busy as an office...the New York headquarters,
unlike the London or Paris offices.
The Irish Catholic lady next to our Midtown office.... I often
run into her in the elevator. She frequently chats with me. Kindly. It's kinda
like very politely. Perhaps inquisitively. She'd like say to me holding a bagel
or coffee in the elevator, like “so YOU are now working for Ishmael?”
And I'd
like reply “yes, Ma'am”. And her eyes would like open wide with compassion. And
she'd like lighten the mood by telling me jokes. Funny pithy elevator jokes.
About how everyone in the building for the past decades couldn't find the
loudest office in the building block – and finally realized it was Merchant
Ivory Productions of international art house acclaim. Right here in the
building. Haha. Then, the elevator doors would close, and we'd say “Bye. Have a
nice day.” And rush to my million and one tasks.
On the secret to success at Merchant Ivory:
Water and fire was what made the team work brilliantly. Merchant
Ivory intrigues everyone in Hollywood. In America, in Europe and in the world.
'Cos it's like the loudest office with the quietest movies? Maybe? It's
certainly the whitest cinema created by the highest percentage of minorities in
any film production house. [laughs]
They're movies that win the most number of Oscars on the lowest
budgets, launching promising actors and talented actresses who start out when
they are mostly unknown, to become the hottest legends and stars of Hollywood
staple.. This isn't just your indie indie. I mean I watched
Merchant Ivory since I was a kid....and that opened my mind to a whole new
world of cinema that wasn't Pretty Woman or Home Alone 2 or Silence
of the Lambs. It was classy Hollywood. Merchant Ivory isn't just films or media. It is a cinematic literary movement. So, it was quite a
cool job.
Merchant Ivory was already reputed worldwide for its subdued
literary art house dramas. They garnered like Oscars after Oscars. Howards End. Remains of the Day. This was
even way before Uma Thurman was cleaning plates near the Meatpacking district.
Merchant Ivory launched Emma Thompson and Anthony Hopkins, then Uma Thurman and Kate Hudson. For me, as a trained actor, and a producer, it was a very normal sort of
office.
On whether as an East Asian, he feels at home at Merchant Ivory:
In some way, Ismail felt very paternal and fatherly to me, as I
was brought up in a very similarly disciplinarian and authoritarian
environment. And he was very patriarchal and masculine. He had his scary,
worrying days, of course. As an invested producer, if nothing goes as planned, everything goes down the drain. But mostly because of a certain pain when you feel
your ambition isn't understood and that everyone around you is useless, as
compared to this Hollywood legend, we all were. He wasn't gay or anything.
[Chuckles] Except for maybe when he wanted to pose for pictures, and added a sari to create an ethnic effect. He's fiercely proud of the beauty and
grand civilization of India, which is mesmerizing.
Despite all the scandals, gossips you hear and read about, they are all untrue. Real life is more boring than you think. I never saw Ismail and James kiss or hold hands or even whisper
romantic innuendos. They were very professional partners. Not gay at all like
all these psychotic gossips you hear and read about. They were like law firm or
banking partners. It was a very loud, butch, dynamic, intense, fast-paced and
neurotic New York type of environment. It definitely wasn't sissy, (not
that gay and or sissy is anything wrong but I digress), it simply wasn't like
what people think art house independent filmmaking is like or should be like. It is highly artistic and professional. Pressure mounts because competition is cut-throat. Art
house cinema is essentially an unsubsidized business in America.
In sky-high rent riddled Manhattan, it's basically just produce or die trying.
I felt at home, perhaps it was because I was also very used to
screaming and shouting from classmates throughout my adolescence during theater
rehearsals. I spent years with really crazy classmates trying to be the next
Brecht, next Artaud, next Shakespeare, all rehearsing for Lear, Macbeth,
Hamlet, The Good Women of Sze Chuan, Hedda Gabbler, etc.. at the same time. So,
no, noise doesn't bother me as it's a sign of vital energy. So Merchant Ivory
felt like home.”
On why Anthony Hopkins went to sue James Ivory:
"[PAUSE].
Hmm. Do you think I can answer that without being sued? I really
do not possess the wherewithal to hire an attorney for defense right now. My
BIBLE OF ROMANCE FUNDS 1, LLC is still open to investment for those running
away from a grossly devalued greenback. [Laughs]
Seriously? Money....nah....maybe anger?.....Or revenge?.....A
grave sense of injustice?... Or a plea?
You gotta remember this. Good actors ARE dramatic... I mean in
real life...and not just on stage....or on film...even if only on stage, sometimes
it carries over......actors are a breed not that much into money....unlike say
a banker....that's why actors get into the acting profession in the
first place. Well, actors need to prove that the drama they feel is so big and
that they share is so important because it's right. Everything else around it
that supposedly serves as justification or excuse is just fuzzy. I feel
therefore I am – that's an actor. I argue therefore I am – that's a lawyer. I
have mountains of cash, therefore I am – that's a banker, fer ya. Thou shalt not confuse the three.
People enter into lawsuits for a variety of reasons but mostly
to prove that they're right when there's a dispute. Lawyers are costly and you
can end up losing good cash after bad. Or an arm or a leg. Or if you're
not lucky, then both. And as actors
spend their entire lives, often starving, working at finding the emotional
truths to their characters, sometimes when they get it right, they go slightly
haywire or a little carried away and need to announce it to the whole world. There's
nothing more dramatic than litigation and trial. As an actor myself, I totally
feel for Anthony. The pain is real.
Everyone knows Merchant Ivory is unadulterated art house and art
house doesn't pay well. Especially during the recession. It's not a sci-fi
thriller like “Bible of Romance”. It doesn't target teenage audiences like
“Bible of Romance”. It doesn't have much ancillary rights to liquidate unlike
“Bible of Romance.” It does not have a long tail of revenue streams like “Bible
of Romance”.
We did not cross-promote Merchant Ivory theatrical runs. Neither
with McDonald's nor Coca-Cola. Not even KFC. We had premieres but they were for
the literati and lifelong art house fans, ladies and gentlemen in mink coats in line in Manhattan, the dowagers and dames and blueblood
supporters of New York City who arrived in limousines to our premieres and diplomats from London and Paris, Japan, China, and of course India. Our goal
wasn't to Walmart-ize cinema to extract cash, but to create great cinema, and great cinema is not just what's on screen. Great cinema is also a great social event.
On whether Anthony Hopkins should have engaged in legal struggle with James Ivory:
I am not in a position to comment.But. I believe actors are better off suing studios cos those are banks.
When Sean Penn taught me a directing class, he told us that the first thing we should learn is: how to rob from studios, get a lot of cash and just make any movie you like, and that's cinema. He's probably being facetious but I believe he's also right. Disclaimer....this is just a general comment and any reference to Sir Anthony Hopkins is merely coincidental and unintentional.
I mean didn't your dad and your mom ever quarrel and fight for
money all the time? But still stayed married and had great sex? Well, maybe
sometimes they divorce.... but in general, couples do have make-up sex and
that's how we came into this world. Litigating for residuals - that's just the
not-so-pretty but real part of life and of Hollywood but the essential part of
making babies called “movies”, I'm afraid.
But to be fair to Sir Anthony Hopkins. Everyone - stars,
producing team, crew, all feel worked very hard on projects as intense as those
we had [at Merchant Ivory]. And when people work very hard, sometimes they tend
to feel shortchanged as a cog in a machine. I think even major stars are not
spared that feeling.
Especially for actors. If you decided to accept a certain job
with less, and were promised certain meaty roles and starring credits. And then
producers and studio execs forgot you, and treated you as disposable, now that
burns. Then, if that promise didn't come true, and someone just wrote you a
fraction of that promise in check, as though they just bought all the rights
over, and ended a love affair, it can burn like acid again. And that burning
can hurt. That has happened to me all the time. I am sure most actors have been
burnt before. And when there's too much burning, you may not want to start a
war, but you have to fight back for your rights. Your dignity. When an actor is
famous respected like Anthony, then I think we tend to enter into the
litigation phase.
But that doesn't mean someone who has been burnt before can't
love again. It just means that it's doubly difficult, and with more burnings,
it becomes more impossible, but then, I digress. Into my latest project “BIBLE
OF ROMANCE”
On Masculinity as East Asian male representation in Hollywood:
"Gender has no race.
Racists and fascists use racial politics gender races, ethnicities and entire civilizations to promote their own skewed ideological agenda. China, Japan and India are not the 'feminine' other; neither is the Anglo-American hierarchy, offshoot of European colonialism a completely 'masculine' culture. You will see white supremacists often mocking the Jewish-American man as being 'feminine', being too 'nerdy', and these all stem from racist stereotypes of a racist American culture that places emphasis on being erudite, religious and holy. There is nothing feminine about a group's culture, religion, ethnicity and civilization. Racists and supremacists like to blur and confuse things into a faux morality, and to instigate mob psychology, witch-hunts and lynchings. Instead of objectivity, evidence, fairness, reflection and judgment.
Masculinity is the
phallus; Feminity is the black hole. Everything else is just obfuscation.
Everything else typical of American masculinity - WWF, football, womanizing, making billion bucks
from an investment bank, big cars, big houses, private jets, space travel,
colonizing Mars. Haha. Those are just illusions.
I think when cavemen look at us and our modern notions of
masculinity, they will roll over and laugh till they fart non-stop.”
"Masculinity is the
phallus;
Femininity is the black hole.
Everything else is mere
obfuscation. "
- Kai Wong
"Masculinity is the
phallus; Feminity is the black hole. Everything else is just obfuscation.
On Independent Cinema and Asian Cinema:
"Let's face it.
Effects-wise, editing, film technology-wise, Hollywood's at the top of the
game, and that's great. But creatively, it's been pretty much dead for a long
long time.
I think Asia is different. Its
technology is still inferior due to hundreds of years of poverty, but this is
changing. In terms of creativity, I believe Chinese, Korean and Japanese and
other Asian civilizations may not be “creative” in the Western sense of the
word, but like the finest sakes or Chinese wines, there's superbly top grade
stuff there in and from Asia. Undiscovered. Secret recipes that's been locked
up for thousands of years secretly, that would be delicious to try. And I'm
convinced American and international audiences would love it. And become
addicted to it.
Coming from Dartmouth, with a
predominantly East Coast school or West Coast indie type of filmmaking
tradition – I mean, my film professors were NYU grads, USC grads, Ang Lee, etc.
- old Hollywood cinema and Independent Cinema were like some sort of Holy
Grail.
We didn't revere Spielberg in
our college Film department, but Martin Scorsese, Claude Berri, Henri Langlois,
Jean-Luc Godard and auteur filmmakers like those were ingrained into us as
sacrosanct and intellectually prestigious. Even our film festivals were
targeted towards more gritty New York independent film-making. We had neither
“E.T”. nor “Gremlins” for our college film festivals. Those were for mid-term
breaks or post-finals movie marathons in the dorms. But not for cinema. In our
Film Society and for our cinema theater, we had serious independent films.
On Contemporary Independent Cinema and Asian Cinema in America:
However, I must say we did not
have much contemporary independent cinema. It's like almost impossible
to distribute independent cinema in the United States, especially outside of
New York City or the Tri-state area. The American movie market, as everyone
knows, is controlled by the major studios and chain cineplexes. They're the
Walmarts, in ways both good and bad, selling basically what's mind food.
Just like Walmart doesn't sell
artisanal or house-made novelty food items, American audiences don't get to buy
independent cinema. The only very rare independent cinema you find in America
is inside the biggest metro areas - independent European cinema in college and
public libraries. Outside of New York, even in LA? My guess is: it's pretty
impossible. Perhaps youtube and facebook, as well as more international travel
is changing all that.
The other type of independent
cinema that you can find in America is Hong Kong or Asian cinema, and sometimes
Bollywood. They're mostly in ethnic enclaves or in Chinatowns. But audiences in
America don't have a mainstream taste for this, unless they are adventuring or
very hungry. Haha.
[Breaks into a charming guffaw.]
End
